Airwaves, Afterwaves, and the Endless Ripples of Storytelling

WEBVTT

NOTE
This file was generated by Descript

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Jim Conrad: Hi, I'm Jim Conrad,
AKA Cono, and this is Conovison.

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Conovison is about storytelling.

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We all have stories to tell.

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We tell each other our stories because
that's how we interpret reality.

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Make sense of the world around us.

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Make sense of our environment.

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And every story has to have a
start, an inception, a birth.

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So to kick things off,
how about our story?

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The story of us?

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So in the beginning, maybe even
long before that, but about 4

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billion years ago, give or take,
earth was a lifeless place.

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Nothing struggled, thought, or wanted.

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Then very, very slowly that changed.

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Seawater leached chemicals
from rocks, near thermal vents.

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Those chemicals jostled and combined.

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Some hit upon the trick of
making copies of themselves.

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That in turn made more copies.

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The replicating chains were caught
in oily bubbles, which protected

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them and made replication easier.

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Eventually, they began to
venture out into the open sea.

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A new level of order had
been achieved on Earth.

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Life had begun.

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Then the Tree of Life grew and
once again, very, very slowly, its

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branches stretching toward complexity.

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Organisms developed systems,
subsystems, and sub-subsystems

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layered in ever deepening regression.

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They used these systems to anticipate
their future and to change it.

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When they looked within, some
found that they had cells.

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Constellations of memories,
ideas and purposes that emerged

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from the systems inside them.

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They experienced being alive.

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And had thoughts about that experience.

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They developed language and
used it to know themselves.

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Then they began to ask how?

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How?

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How had they been made?

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This to a first approximation is
the secular story of our creation.

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It has no single author.

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It's been written collaboratively
by scientists over the past

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few centuries, but now in the
age of artificial intelligence,

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possibly, the next question is why.

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Here's a story about dude philosophy.

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The wisdom of the surfer is often
understood to be a kind of anti-wisdom,

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a rejection of the idea that life's
deepest truths must be elusive or

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hard won, or even especially deep.

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Jeff Spicoli: A surfing's not a sport.

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It's a way of life.

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No hobby.

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It's a way of looking at that wave
and saying, Hey bud, let's party.

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Jim Conrad: Thus speak Jeff Spicoli
in Fast Times at Ridgemont High.

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This is surfing as the unexamined
life, the renunciation of philosophy.

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An opposing school of thought
holds that surfers do discover deep

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truths, presumably by virtue of their
spending a lot of time in the ocean.

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We are all equal before a wave.

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This somewhat immersive aphorism from
big wave surfing god Laird Hamilton

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is illustrative of the genre, an
earnest maxim of kinship and humility.

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It is also, as anyone who has
ever watched Hamilton surf

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could attest, simply not true.

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This is surfing is pseudo philosophy.

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The problem in both cases
is a category error.

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We're not drawn to surfers
because of what they say.

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We are drawn to surfers
because of what they do.

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It's not their insights that
interest us, it's their knowhow.

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If there is wisdom to be
gleaned from the surfer, that's

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where we're going to find it.

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In the characteristic competencies
that constitute his form of life.

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Reading waves, riding waves,
weighing the duties of work against

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the capricious call of the sea.

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What a proper philosophy of surfing
requires, in other words, is a thinker

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good enough at surfing to possess all that
practical knowledge, but also good enough

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at philosophy to make explicit what theory
of the world, if any, it amounts to.

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Enter Aaron James.

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He is a professor of philosophy
at the University of California

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Irvine and an accomplished surfer.

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His book, Surfing With Sartre, aims to
articulate the distinctive philosophical

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value of the surfer way of being.

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His conclusion is bold.

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What the surfer knows, in knowing how to
ride a wave, bears on questions for the

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ages about freedom, control, happiness,
society, our relation to nature, the value

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of work, and the very meaning of life.

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Professor James is aware that his
enterprise will strike some as a

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comically grandiose rationalization for
his favorite pastime and the somewhat

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obligatory ambition of his argument.

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Can you imagine writing a book
that says, surfing explains just

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two of the questions for the ages.

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No.

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Means some chapters are more
compelling than others, but it is as

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genuinely a philosophical book about
surfing as you're ever gonna get.

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Savvy philosophers distill their
core insight as a short phrase.

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For Adam Smith, it was invisible hand.

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For David Hume, confined generosity.

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For John Rawls, veil of ignorance.

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In James' book, the fundamental
idea is adaptive attunement.

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This is what he takes to
be the essence of surfing.

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For someone to be surfing,
three conditions must be met.

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He must be attuned to a
shifting phenomenon outside

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of himself, like a wave.

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He must be adjusting himself in
response to it, adapting, so as to be

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carried along by its propulsive forces.

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And he must be doing so
intentionally and for its own sake.

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That is because negotiating the
world in this manner strikes

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him as intrinsically valuable.

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You are surfing if, and only
if, you are adaptively attuned.

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By defining surfing in this formal and
abstract way, James frees himself to

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talk not just about surfing waves, but
also about surfing in an extended sense.

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For example, surfing through a
cocktail party conversation or

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down a busy Manhattan sidewalk.

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Surfers surf when they're in the
water, but in other aspects of

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their lives too, as can we all, and,
well, we should, James contends.

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He presents adaptive attunement as
a fruitful way to understand how

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much of the world works, as well
as a winning strategy for life.

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Take the question of free will.

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There is a curious passage in Jean-Paul
Sartre's Being and Nothingness

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in which Sartre discusses human
freedom by likening it to skiing.

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Sartre's was a radical conception
of freedom, according to which human

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beings in an almost godlike way
could fashion themselves unencumbered

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by the constraints of the world.

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In searching for a metaphor
for this, Sartre considered

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but rejected ice skating.

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The skater's path was too dependent
on the hard resistance of the ice,

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and eventually hit upon skiing.

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Snow was soft, so the skier
imposed his will more easily.

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It left behind a less defined trace.

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Sartre conceded that a better metaphor
would be some form of sliding on water.

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The vanishing trace of the rider's
path would suggest an even greater

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degree of autonomy from the world.

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But evidently he wasn't
familiar with surfing.

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Professor James regrets that Sartre
did not get to think about surfing.

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If he had, he might have been led to
a different, and as James sees it,

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more convincing theory of freedom.

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Sartre was an incompatibilist
about free will.

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He considered freedom to be at odds
with the deterministic universe

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implied by our best physics.

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In what sense are you free if you
could not have acted otherwise?

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But James is a compatibilist.

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He thinks there is a meaningful
sense of freedom consistent with

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being trapped by the laws of nature.

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Indeed, he thinks the surfer
derived notion of adaptive

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attunement captures that sense.

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As the surfer knows, freedom is
not a matter of imposing your

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will, Sartre like on the world.

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That's a surefire way to wipe out,

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freedom, rather is a matter
of trying ascending your will.

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And accepting the exchange or two-way
relationship between what you intend

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to do and what you are constrained
to do by the forces around you.

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You take what the wave gives you.

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In the deterministic universe, freedom
is the sensation known to the adaptively

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attuned of efficacy without control.

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The surfer is right.

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Sartre is wrong.

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Given that Professor James's principle
area of academic expertise is political

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philosophy, it's not surprising that
his chapters in the book on society

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and work are particularly strong.

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Surfers may want to flip straight to
his argument for the necessity of a

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more leisurely, surfer friendly style
of capitalism, in which some people work

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less and surf more in the interest of
offsetting carbon emissions, of course.

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But hey, why stop at reforming capitalism.

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To those people who spend their
workday sitting at desks in front

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of computers, furtively checking
webcam footage of their local breaks,

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I say, surfers of the world unite.

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We have nothing to lose but our jobs.

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A review of the book, Surfing with
Sartre: An Aquatic Inquiry into a Life

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of Meaning, by Aaron James, written by
James Ryerson of the New York Times.

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And now a story from a guy who grew
up in Surf City, US of A. Ladies

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and gentlemen, please welcome
the one, the only, Jesse Dylan.

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Can you hear me, Jesse?

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Jesse Dylan: I can hear you and myself.

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Jim Conrad: It's the Conovison podcast.

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I am Jim Conrad, AKA
Cono with Jesse Dylan.

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Hi Jesse.

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Jesse Dylan: I forgot to ask, is it
scale, or scale and a half, or double

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scale, or do we not do that anymore?

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What am I getting paid for this?

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Jim Conrad: Oh no, it's
uh, cyber currency.

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It's the cyber scale.

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Yeah, but okay.

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But we gotta start somewhere.

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Let's start the story with your dad.

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He was born in Edmonton.

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Jesse Dylan: My dad was born in Edmonton
and he started his radio career at

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CKUA and one day they brought this
guy in, good looking guy, and I think

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they were both about 19 years old.

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And he said, this is
gonna be your sports guy.

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And it was Robert Goulet.

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Jim Conrad: The, the famous.

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Jesse Dylan: The crooner.

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Jim Conrad: Robert Goulet, who
we know kind of, but crooner.

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But he was a Broadway star.

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Jesse Dylan: Yes.

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Yeah.

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He was a Broadway star.

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Vegas star.

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Jim Conrad: But from Edmonton?

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Jesse Dylan: No, he's an American.

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I can't remember where.

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Minnesota, something like that.

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But I guess his family moved to Edmonton
when he was a young lad, and when he was

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19 he had this huge baritone voice, right?

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So they, uh, my dad and
him became fast friends.

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They had a lot of fun.

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Jim Conrad: In Edmonton.

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Jesse Dylan: In Edmonton.

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And years later, my dad's career took
him to Montreal, CFCF TV and radio.

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We also had a, um, a puppet
show back in the day.

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You like puppets?

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Jim Conrad: I like puppets.

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High heels and hand puppets.

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Jesse Dylan: So I remember, we couldn't
find dates, but we had puppets on a

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camping trip, but we won't go there.

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So from, uh, from Montreal to Vancouver.

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CKWX back in the, uh, early days,
and then we moved to Toronto.

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Jim Conrad: So in between all of
this, you were born in which city?

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Jesse Dylan: Montreal.

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And then we lived in Vancouver,
West Vancouver when I was a young

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boy, and then suddenly we're in
Toronto and my dad's doing mornings

00:14:16.180 --> 00:14:18.130
with Keith Rich, Woodman and Rich.

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My dad's name Steve Woodman.

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And so Woodman and Rich on CKY,
big morning show in Toronto

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back in the early sixties.

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Kind of a funny story.

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Jim Conrad: I'll be the judge of that.

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Jesse Dylan: The president of programming
for NBC radio out of New York City

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was flying through bad weather.

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They had to land in Toronto and I guess he
spent the night before they could fly, he

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was flying from like Alaska to New York.

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And then the next morning he's turning
on the radio on the way to the airport

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and he's listening to Woodman and Rich.

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He gets to New York.

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Phones up Steve Woodman, my dad,
and says, Hey man, how would you

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and your partner like to come and do
national radio out of New York on NBC?

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Jim Conrad: Luck.

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Jesse Dylan: Luck, right?

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So they did, and we, so we
had an estate in New Jersey.

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My dad was doing TV and radio
in New York City at 30 Rock.

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He and Robert Goulet and all their
pals, Jimmy Dean, Chuck McCann.

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My dad and Goulet had a
penthouse in Manhattan.

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Although he lived with his
family, us, in New Jersey.

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It was Rat Pack, right.

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Sixties.

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So these guys would be out partying,
having a ball, uh, doing their thing.

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Goulet was on cam a lot at
the time with Richard Burton.

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And my dad was TV, radio, NBC.

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Jim Conrad: Wow.

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How old were you when you were
living in New Jersey on the estate?

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Did you get to see the penthouse?

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Jesse Dylan: No, no.

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That was the poon palace.

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I wasn't poon.

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I would've been if Diddy had been there.

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But I'm, I missed that charade.

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Jim Conrad: Uh, you grew up then in,
in and around New Jersey and New York.

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And then when did you leave?

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Jesse Dylan: Nine.

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About nine years old we
moved to Malibu, California.

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Jim Conrad: Right.

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And your dad did radio in LA.

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Jesse Dylan: He did, uh, the
morning show at KDAY, which was a

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legendary station back in the day.

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And he did a television
show and a teen show.

00:15:59.445 --> 00:16:03.295
So the show he was doing in New York
was very much like what Dick Clark was

00:16:03.310 --> 00:16:07.030
doing with Bandstand in Philadelphia
only they were doing it in New York.

00:16:07.090 --> 00:16:08.940
Never became quite as famous as Dick's.

00:16:08.940 --> 00:16:10.550
Jim Conrad: So Malibu, California.

00:16:10.550 --> 00:16:13.510
Mbu, And this is now, you're nine,
10 years old, landing in Surf City.

00:16:13.600 --> 00:16:14.190
Jesse Dylan: Zuma Beach.

00:16:14.750 --> 00:16:15.930
We lived just above Zuma Beach.

00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:17.130
And we had horses.

00:16:17.670 --> 00:16:19.210
A lot of people don't know that.

00:16:19.210 --> 00:16:21.520
You know, they see the fires and
they think everybody is a Hollywood

00:16:21.520 --> 00:16:22.750
legend living on the ocean.

00:16:22.780 --> 00:16:27.010
But Malibu had ranch country,
wineries, horses, agriculture.

00:16:27.190 --> 00:16:30.680
So we were part of the, the horse group
and the beach group and the surfing group.

00:16:30.860 --> 00:16:32.880
Was a junior lifeguard there
for three or four years.

00:16:33.180 --> 00:16:36.329
Jim Conrad: And then what
phase of your development did

00:16:36.329 --> 00:16:37.859
you decide, enough of this.

00:16:37.859 --> 00:16:40.349
I want to get out of here,
or do I wanna stay here?

00:16:40.349 --> 00:16:41.040
What do I wanna do?

00:16:41.099 --> 00:16:41.280
Jesse Dylan: Where?

00:16:41.280 --> 00:16:41.699
In Malibu?

00:16:41.760 --> 00:16:42.119
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:16:42.359 --> 00:16:43.890
Jesse Dylan: Oh, well, we
moved back as a family.

00:16:43.979 --> 00:16:44.400
Jim Conrad: Oh, okay.

00:16:44.400 --> 00:16:45.060
So you came back.

00:16:45.239 --> 00:16:47.699
Jesse Dylan: 1970 we moved back to Canada.

00:16:47.790 --> 00:16:51.060
My dad again was at CKWX in 1970.

00:16:51.110 --> 00:16:53.150
I think from 70 to 74.

00:16:53.510 --> 00:16:53.750
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:16:53.750 --> 00:16:55.490
I wanna talk about, because
there obviously there was

00:16:55.490 --> 00:16:56.690
something that happened.

00:16:56.690 --> 00:17:00.589
He, he worked very hard and was very
successful in LA and in Hollywood.

00:17:00.650 --> 00:17:03.620
And then something happened
that caused you all or him to

00:17:03.620 --> 00:17:04.880
decide to move back to Canada.

00:17:05.089 --> 00:17:05.690
What was that?

00:17:05.780 --> 00:17:07.579
Jesse Dylan: Well, I was 16 at the time.

00:17:07.579 --> 00:17:09.440
My brother was, uh, 18.

00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:11.810
My older brother, come
from a family of seven.

00:17:11.870 --> 00:17:14.930
There was some concern that we were
coming up for the draft in Vietnam.

00:17:15.094 --> 00:17:16.954
So that's what my parents say.

00:17:17.014 --> 00:17:18.974
It was probably the,
you know, tax evasion.

00:17:19.155 --> 00:17:21.125
Jim Conrad: You're 17, 18, 19 years old.

00:17:21.125 --> 00:17:22.204
Jesse Dylan: 1974.

00:17:22.204 --> 00:17:24.395
It was a brand new high school
in Tsawwassen where we lived.

00:17:24.544 --> 00:17:25.895
South Delta Senior Secondary.

00:17:25.954 --> 00:17:28.084
They were looking for a
president, brand new school.

00:17:28.084 --> 00:17:32.014
I knew no one, we just moved
from Fort Langley to there.

00:17:32.584 --> 00:17:33.415
Good move, by the way.

00:17:33.695 --> 00:17:36.185
Fort Langley was rough in the
seventies, man, I'm telling you.

00:17:36.274 --> 00:17:38.225
You're not from around here, are you?

00:17:38.225 --> 00:17:38.544
No.

00:17:38.804 --> 00:17:39.014
No.

00:17:39.374 --> 00:17:44.310
When we parachuted in from Malibu,
California to Fort Langley in 1970.

00:17:44.720 --> 00:17:46.500
I don't know why my dad thought it'd,

00:17:46.500 --> 00:17:49.080
Jim Conrad: Well, that's,
it was still 1954 there.

00:17:49.470 --> 00:17:51.310
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, it was
American graffiti basically.

00:17:51.520 --> 00:17:54.770
It was white T-shirts,
tight jeans, cowboy boots.

00:17:54.960 --> 00:17:55.750
Farm boys.

00:17:55.750 --> 00:17:57.360
And all of them were tough.

00:17:57.360 --> 00:17:58.170
Every single one of them.

00:17:58.320 --> 00:17:59.159
Took my licks.

00:17:59.210 --> 00:18:02.120
Eventually, you know, took
a few, got a couple in, and

00:18:02.120 --> 00:18:03.409
eventually we all became friends.

00:18:03.470 --> 00:18:06.860
The first guy I met in that school at
Fort Langley looked like the wicked

00:18:06.860 --> 00:18:09.060
witch from the original Wizard of Oz.

00:18:11.930 --> 00:18:12.690
Jim Conrad: Was

00:18:14.700 --> 00:18:15.250
he green?

00:18:15.840 --> 00:18:16.629
Jesse Dylan: Pretty close.

00:18:16.919 --> 00:18:22.240
Had a, the large witch nose,
beady eyes, And a white t-shirt.

00:18:22.310 --> 00:18:23.180
Cigarettes rolled up.

00:18:23.210 --> 00:18:27.230
And he came up to me in the hallway,
first day at school and he said, uh,

00:18:27.230 --> 00:18:30.440
lovingly of course, you wait till,
he grabbed me by the throat, put me

00:18:30.440 --> 00:18:33.560
against the lockers and said, just wait
till lunch you long-haired cocksucker.

00:18:36.080 --> 00:18:39.280
And as I said, I wasn't disappointed.

00:18:40.260 --> 00:18:42.020
He made, he made good on that promise.

00:18:42.050 --> 00:18:44.240
Him and his buddies, him and his buddies.

00:18:44.245 --> 00:18:44.655
Jim Conrad: Didn't kill ya.

00:18:44.945 --> 00:18:45.845
Didn't maim you.

00:18:45.875 --> 00:18:46.175
Jesse Dylan: Nope.

00:18:46.175 --> 00:18:49.074
But like, it wasn't a welcome basket
and say, welcome to our neighborhood.

00:18:49.074 --> 00:18:50.875
Jim Conrad: Well that was, well that
was how, that's how they did it.

00:18:51.095 --> 00:18:53.345
That, that was, he was the welcome wagon.

00:18:55.685 --> 00:18:57.665
Strange Fort Langley welcome wagon.

00:18:57.845 --> 00:18:58.115
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:18:58.175 --> 00:18:58.715
It was.

00:18:59.855 --> 00:19:01.415
And it, it actually got worse on the bus.

00:19:01.595 --> 00:19:05.975
It was bad enough at lunchtime, but fun on
the bus after school that day was worse.

00:19:06.064 --> 00:19:06.514
Jim Conrad: Oh.

00:19:06.844 --> 00:19:10.054
But so you got outta there to Tsawwassen,
which was in the mid seventies.

00:19:10.355 --> 00:19:12.215
Jesse Dylan: Um, 1974.

00:19:12.215 --> 00:19:14.284
Jim Conrad: A bit of an isolated
community wasn't it, out there?

00:19:14.284 --> 00:19:15.334
Jesse Dylan: It was a nice community.

00:19:15.614 --> 00:19:15.985
Nice.

00:19:16.159 --> 00:19:17.080
No greasers.

00:19:17.110 --> 00:19:17.685
Jim Conrad: Tunnel town.

00:19:17.865 --> 00:19:19.754
And then you went to BCIT?

00:19:19.784 --> 00:19:20.115
Jesse Dylan: I did.

00:19:20.115 --> 00:19:23.324
I was doing the, um, as I, I, I
ran for student council president.

00:19:23.415 --> 00:19:24.014
I won.

00:19:24.225 --> 00:19:27.705
And for two years as student council
president at South Delta Senior Secondary

00:19:27.705 --> 00:19:29.655
I got to read the PA announcements.

00:19:29.824 --> 00:19:31.574
Turned it into a little mini radio show.

00:19:31.754 --> 00:19:33.554
I think all of us did that.

00:19:33.654 --> 00:19:34.784
All of us started in high school.

00:19:34.965 --> 00:19:38.475
So I was kind of never really with
it, or maybe out of it, while my

00:19:38.475 --> 00:19:41.355
dad was in the business, certainly
out of it in Malibu in the sixties.

00:19:41.355 --> 00:19:42.205
I can promise you that.

00:19:42.820 --> 00:19:45.430
Uh, we were all out of it in
California in the sixties.

00:19:45.580 --> 00:19:46.629
Jim Conrad: Did you drop acid?

00:19:46.780 --> 00:19:47.260
Jesse Dylan: Oh, yeah.

00:19:47.500 --> 00:19:50.110
Jim Conrad: Uh, in Malibu with
the Beach Boys, with Brian Wilson.

00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:52.629
Jesse Dylan: I didn't drop with Brian
Wilson, but pretty well everyone else.

00:19:52.720 --> 00:19:55.650
I had done a Tony the Tiger
Sugar Frosted Flake commercial.

00:19:55.720 --> 00:19:59.060
And we had seven kids and
we, Dorothy Day Otis Agency.

00:19:59.340 --> 00:19:59.950
I remember that.

00:20:00.129 --> 00:20:01.160
And we all had an agent.

00:20:01.660 --> 00:20:03.920
My mother or father
would schlep us around.

00:20:04.040 --> 00:20:06.320
My parents would whore us out for
the lowest common denominator.

00:20:07.520 --> 00:20:11.030
And so I got a, uh, sugar Frosted
Flake commercial, Tony the Tiger.

00:20:11.060 --> 00:20:13.340
So I'm this like teenage
guy, 13 years old, right?

00:20:13.490 --> 00:20:14.490
And I got the commercial.

00:20:14.520 --> 00:20:17.270
And back in the day the
residuals were fucking massive.

00:20:17.510 --> 00:20:19.160
In the US they went on forever, right?

00:20:19.220 --> 00:20:22.010
It was a national Tony the Tiger
sugar Frosted Flake commercial.

00:20:22.700 --> 00:20:27.230
I'm dancing with this chick to
some fucking hip music, right?

00:20:27.290 --> 00:20:28.010
This is the commercial.

00:20:28.195 --> 00:20:31.554
And I hadn't, there was a pan
of her eating her breakfast,

00:20:31.554 --> 00:20:33.254
which was sugar Frosted Flakes.

00:20:33.254 --> 00:20:35.485
Jim Conrad: And then you get up and dance.

00:20:35.485 --> 00:20:39.614
Jesse Dylan: And we get up and dance, but
I hadn't eaten my sugar Frosted Flakes.

00:20:40.084 --> 00:20:41.894
So I run out of energy.

00:20:42.034 --> 00:20:49.035
And when the tiger says, go, go, go, as
Tony the Tiger, I faint and pass out.

00:20:49.135 --> 00:20:51.415
And then it pans to me
eating sugar Frosted Flakes.

00:20:51.415 --> 00:20:52.159
And now you're back.

00:20:52.159 --> 00:20:52.709
I get my energy,

00:20:55.310 --> 00:20:55.580
right?

00:20:55.580 --> 00:20:57.429
So the residual started pouring in.

00:20:58.179 --> 00:21:01.040
And uh, my parents took the money,
of course, we had seven kids.

00:21:01.040 --> 00:21:03.110
Jim Conrad: Not as much as
Tony the Tiger, but, yeah.

00:21:03.140 --> 00:21:03.380
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:21:03.380 --> 00:21:05.810
They, they had mouths to
feed, but, but checks.

00:21:05.810 --> 00:21:08.120
Jim Conrad: So they got, they
got the, they took the checks.

00:21:08.120 --> 00:21:09.530
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, they took
the checks, as they should.

00:21:09.620 --> 00:21:10.700
Jim Conrad: Which is kind of a, yeah.

00:21:10.730 --> 00:21:12.650
Uh, I mean, that's kind
of a Hollywood tradition.

00:21:12.740 --> 00:21:13.940
Jesse Dylan: But, but
I gotta check one day.

00:21:14.110 --> 00:21:15.804
I found it hadn't been open yet.

00:21:15.865 --> 00:21:22.405
$235. 1968, 69. I take the check,
I go to the Bank of America.

00:21:22.855 --> 00:21:23.935
I don't have a bank account.

00:21:23.965 --> 00:21:27.184
I don't even know what a bank account
is, but I'm gonna cash this check.

00:21:28.054 --> 00:21:28.834
I cashed the check.

00:21:29.004 --> 00:21:29.754
They gave me the money.

00:21:30.054 --> 00:21:32.304
I went down to the beach and I
think I bought a hundred hits

00:21:32.334 --> 00:21:33.865
of yellow uh, orange sunshine.

00:21:33.895 --> 00:21:34.885
Jim Conrad: Orange sunshine.

00:21:34.915 --> 00:21:36.024
Well, of course it's California.

00:21:36.054 --> 00:21:36.955
Jesse Dylan: Lemme
think what I got for it.

00:21:36.955 --> 00:21:39.205
I think it was like 235 bucks.

00:21:39.755 --> 00:21:41.555
I think at the time it
was two bucks a hit.

00:21:42.345 --> 00:21:42.985
Sound about right?

00:21:44.435 --> 00:21:48.785
So when you asked about
LSD, that was a bad night.

00:21:49.115 --> 00:21:51.725
Jim Conrad: Oh, not a
good, not a good trip.

00:21:51.815 --> 00:21:51.875
Jesse Dylan: No.

00:21:51.875 --> 00:21:56.045
I shared a lot of it with
friends, but I did way too much.

00:21:56.075 --> 00:21:56.315
Jim Conrad: Oh.

00:21:56.585 --> 00:21:57.455
Oh, okay.

00:21:57.455 --> 00:21:57.605
Yeah.

00:21:57.605 --> 00:21:58.685
Jesse Dylan: So that
was the beginning of a,

00:21:59.075 --> 00:22:00.125
Jim Conrad: Not microdosing.

00:22:00.245 --> 00:22:01.715
What, whatever the opposite of that is.

00:22:01.775 --> 00:22:02.225
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, yeah.

00:22:02.225 --> 00:22:03.395
But you asked if I did acid.

00:22:03.545 --> 00:22:06.365
That wasn't the only time, but that
was one of the more prolific nights.

00:22:06.365 --> 00:22:07.295
That did not end well.

00:22:07.325 --> 00:22:08.255
That night ended badly.

00:22:08.375 --> 00:22:09.395
Jim Conrad: Did you have an epiphany?

00:22:09.935 --> 00:22:12.325
No, but the neighbors did.

00:22:14.535 --> 00:22:18.035
Jesse Dylan: They found me in their car,
which they had packed up the night before

00:22:18.035 --> 00:22:20.635
for their summer vacation, torn to pieces.

00:22:20.635 --> 00:22:23.415
You know, I'm gonna be honest with you.

00:22:23.415 --> 00:22:25.725
10 hits of Orange
Sunshine is one too many.

00:22:28.735 --> 00:22:29.635
Jim Conrad: Oh, that's funny.

00:22:29.735 --> 00:22:31.635
That's a great story.

00:22:31.635 --> 00:22:32.555
I love it.

00:22:32.675 --> 00:22:33.055
Okay.

00:22:33.085 --> 00:22:37.814
Now we're back from Fort Langley to
Tsawwassen and now you're going to BCIT.

00:22:37.875 --> 00:22:39.764
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, two
years, PA Announcements.

00:22:39.764 --> 00:22:41.685
Counselor said, would you
consider going to BCIT?

00:22:41.685 --> 00:22:42.165
I said, sure.

00:22:42.195 --> 00:22:43.334
You know, if I was gonna be a lawyer.

00:22:43.530 --> 00:22:46.290
Weirdly enough, a lot of lawyers
wanted to be broadcasters and a lot

00:22:46.290 --> 00:22:47.769
of broadcasters wanted to be lawyers.

00:22:47.769 --> 00:22:50.669
Like it must have something to do with
performing in front of a group, right?

00:22:50.790 --> 00:22:50.969
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:22:50.969 --> 00:22:52.049
Maybe we're all just dicks.

00:22:52.179 --> 00:22:52.969
Jesse Dylan: There we go.

00:22:53.070 --> 00:22:55.949
I said, sure, yeah, I'll, I'll go for
an interview at BCIT and I went for an

00:22:55.949 --> 00:23:01.800
interview at BCIT, Sandy Sanderson, Doug
Short, all these legendary broadcasters.

00:23:01.949 --> 00:23:03.989
I had a little interview and
they said, well, if you're, if

00:23:03.989 --> 00:23:07.525
you're bound to be even half as
good as your father, you're in.

00:23:07.555 --> 00:23:09.385
So BCIT two years.

00:23:09.955 --> 00:23:13.135
I was working full-time in my second
year at BCIT, but I didn't want to quit.

00:23:13.195 --> 00:23:15.145
And then I got placed in Victoria.

00:23:15.245 --> 00:23:16.054
Jim Conrad: CJVI.

00:23:16.185 --> 00:23:16.465
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:23:16.465 --> 00:23:17.064
CJVI.

00:23:17.064 --> 00:23:18.305
And you were at CFAX.

00:23:18.325 --> 00:23:20.605
Jim Conrad: And I think the
ships just passed in the night.

00:23:20.635 --> 00:23:25.045
'Cause I think you left and I
got there probably March 1st, 79.

00:23:25.135 --> 00:23:28.595
Jesse Dylan: I left around
the same time to come to LG73.

00:23:28.615 --> 00:23:29.755
Jim Conrad: I saw you at the airport.

00:23:29.785 --> 00:23:34.525
I flew from Medicine Hat where it was
minus 30 to Calgary where it was the same.

00:23:34.615 --> 00:23:36.985
And then, uh, met a friend
of mine in the parking lot.

00:23:37.075 --> 00:23:39.505
We didn't do acid, but we did
pretty much everything else.

00:23:39.654 --> 00:23:43.195
Got on the plane and now I
am leaving to go to Victoria

00:23:43.195 --> 00:23:44.764
to this new job in Victoria.

00:23:45.044 --> 00:23:45.695
I get there.

00:23:45.695 --> 00:23:49.435
Paul Tividar, he was the program director
of CFAX, picked me up in his ragtop

00:23:49.435 --> 00:23:53.634
MG and we're cruising down from the
airport, right, down the Pat Bay Highway.

00:23:53.975 --> 00:23:56.215
You come over that rise
just before Elk Lake.

00:23:56.514 --> 00:23:56.604
Jesse Dylan: Oh yeah.

00:23:56.604 --> 00:23:56.995
Beautiful spot.

00:23:57.054 --> 00:24:00.475
Jim Conrad: And you see the
Victoria in the foreground.

00:24:00.735 --> 00:24:04.124
Juan de Fuca Strait, the ocean
for a prairie kid, you know,

00:24:04.334 --> 00:24:06.044
and then the Olympic Mountains.

00:24:06.524 --> 00:24:09.314
And the radio station was
on the top floor of, uh,

00:24:09.495 --> 00:24:10.245
Jesse Dylan: The Douglas Hotel.

00:24:10.274 --> 00:24:10.485
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:24:10.485 --> 00:24:11.144
No, View Street.

00:24:11.324 --> 00:24:11.594
Jesse Dylan: Okay.

00:24:11.594 --> 00:24:11.774
Yeah.

00:24:11.774 --> 00:24:13.274
The basement was CKDA.

00:24:13.334 --> 00:24:13.544
Yeah.

00:24:13.544 --> 00:24:14.384
Jim Conrad: That was in the basement.

00:24:14.384 --> 00:24:15.134
Jesse Dylan: See, um, yeah.

00:24:15.134 --> 00:24:15.735
Radio hell.

00:24:15.824 --> 00:24:16.844
Das Boot we call it.

00:24:17.235 --> 00:24:18.934
Jim Conrad: But CKDA was the cool station.

00:24:19.104 --> 00:24:19.874
'Cause they was played rock.

00:24:19.904 --> 00:24:22.975
Jesse Dylan: It was, it was
the LG73 or C fund of Victoria.

00:24:23.024 --> 00:24:23.445
Jim Conrad: Definitely.

00:24:23.445 --> 00:24:24.399
Jesse Dylan: CFAX was the NW.

00:24:24.864 --> 00:24:29.454
CJVI was the CGOR wannabe, you know,
we wanted to be CFAX, so we had Joe

00:24:29.454 --> 00:24:31.944
Ewood, Ed Mackenzie, all those guys.

00:24:31.944 --> 00:24:33.784
Me, I did the midday show, nine till noon.

00:24:33.784 --> 00:24:34.564
It was a request.

00:24:34.564 --> 00:24:35.165
It was country.

00:24:35.264 --> 00:24:36.554
So I saw, I started in country.

00:24:36.685 --> 00:24:37.564
It was horrible.

00:24:37.754 --> 00:24:39.024
I mean CJVI was fun.

00:24:39.234 --> 00:24:40.014
It was really fun.

00:24:40.044 --> 00:24:41.244
I started on the All night show.

00:24:41.544 --> 00:24:42.864
I lasted there about three months.

00:24:42.864 --> 00:24:47.724
And then Bob Morris, at CKDA, made me
an an offer to come and work in top 40.

00:24:47.784 --> 00:24:50.904
And my buddy there, Richard
Saxton, Richard was there and I

00:24:50.904 --> 00:24:52.194
was really looking forward to it.

00:24:52.194 --> 00:24:54.534
And then CJVI made me a better offer.

00:24:54.725 --> 00:24:57.904
They wanted to keep me and this was
cool 'cause I was only supposed to do a

00:24:57.904 --> 00:24:59.614
practicum and I was now working full time.

00:24:59.674 --> 00:25:00.455
Jim Conrad: Yeah, you're 20 years old.

00:25:00.544 --> 00:25:00.754
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:25:00.754 --> 00:25:04.084
Well if that, and I've got a job
offer from Bob Morris at CKDA

00:25:04.084 --> 00:25:05.374
to go work at the cool station.

00:25:05.884 --> 00:25:09.394
But Harry Boone, the program director
at CJVI, gave me more money, moved

00:25:09.394 --> 00:25:11.794
me off the all night show, gave me
my own show Monday through Friday,

00:25:11.794 --> 00:25:14.044
night till noon, the request show.

00:25:14.134 --> 00:25:15.304
Jim Conrad: But it was
country and western requests.

00:25:15.304 --> 00:25:17.689
Jesse Dylan: But when you start,
when you start radio back in the

00:25:17.689 --> 00:25:21.769
days, uh, you and I are are both old
enough to remember block formatting.

00:25:21.919 --> 00:25:24.139
So you would play some shit from the CBC.

00:25:24.139 --> 00:25:26.539
You would have some bad religious
motherfucker that you had to play

00:25:26.569 --> 00:25:27.739
'cause they would buy an hour of time.

00:25:27.739 --> 00:25:28.819
Jim Conrad: Bernice Gerard.

00:25:28.879 --> 00:25:29.269
Jesse Dylan: Oh no.

00:25:29.269 --> 00:25:32.389
I had Garner Ted Armstrong, so
I'd have to play him in the middle

00:25:32.389 --> 00:25:33.739
of the night off reel to reel.

00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:37.309
And then I had comedy hour and that's
where I discovered George Carlin.

00:25:37.399 --> 00:25:39.259
George Carlin: Politicians are
put there to give you the idea

00:25:39.259 --> 00:25:40.304
that you have freedom of choice.

00:25:41.120 --> 00:25:41.719
You don't.

00:25:42.350 --> 00:25:43.580
You have no choice.

00:25:43.699 --> 00:25:44.810
You have owners.

00:25:44.929 --> 00:25:46.310
They own you.

00:25:46.459 --> 00:25:47.929
They own everything.

00:25:48.019 --> 00:25:49.850
They own all the important land.

00:25:50.029 --> 00:25:51.830
They own and control the corporations.

00:25:51.830 --> 00:25:54.080
They've long since bought and
paid for the Senate, the Congress,

00:25:54.080 --> 00:25:55.340
the state houses, the city halls.

00:25:55.340 --> 00:25:58.850
They got the judges in their back pockets
and they own all the big media companies,

00:25:58.850 --> 00:26:02.060
so they control just about all of the
news and information you get to hear.

00:26:02.179 --> 00:26:04.039
They got you by the balls.

00:26:04.580 --> 00:26:06.039
Jesse Dylan: Oh, it's still very relevant.

00:26:06.229 --> 00:26:07.219
More so now than ever.

00:26:07.374 --> 00:26:12.445
Jim Conrad: So Carlin and comedy, but
Victoria was too small for Jesse Dylan,

00:26:12.445 --> 00:26:22.624
and you had to come to the Big Smoke LG73.

00:26:22.624 --> 00:26:23.644
Jesse Dylan: I stayed there a year.

00:26:23.665 --> 00:26:28.379
And then Roy Hennessy, who was programming
CFOX took me with him to CHED in

00:26:28.399 --> 00:26:32.929
Edmonton and that was, uh, fun because
CHED in the day had like a 53 share of

00:26:32.929 --> 00:26:34.850
market, not my favorite place to live.

00:26:34.850 --> 00:26:36.230
I mean that in the nicest, kindest way.

00:26:36.230 --> 00:26:40.699
You know, if God was gonna give Canada
an enema or if he was playing golf,

00:26:40.699 --> 00:26:41.719
Jim Conrad: I thought
it's, it's Moose Jaw.

00:26:41.989 --> 00:26:44.389
Jesse Dylan: If he had to shit
in a bush playing golf, Edmonton.

00:26:47.034 --> 00:26:49.205
Jim Conrad: Dear diary,
everything is going to be okay.

00:26:50.134 --> 00:26:52.144
And if it isn't, we'll fix it in post.

00:26:55.114 --> 00:26:57.485
Jesse Dylan: So, um, how do I put this?

00:26:57.904 --> 00:26:59.134
As delicately as I can.

00:26:59.194 --> 00:27:01.654
We fucked off as quickly
as we could from Edmonton.

00:27:01.714 --> 00:27:01.864
Jim Conrad: Yes.

00:27:01.864 --> 00:27:02.044
Yeah.

00:27:02.194 --> 00:27:04.894
Luckily the airport is on, on your
way outta town, which is really good.

00:27:04.894 --> 00:27:05.854
Like way outta town.

00:27:05.884 --> 00:27:06.094
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:27:06.094 --> 00:27:08.914
The two best things to come out of
Edmonton, Highway South and the airport.

00:27:08.914 --> 00:27:09.154
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:27:09.154 --> 00:27:11.314
It leads Canada in squirrel suicides.

00:27:12.034 --> 00:27:14.344
Jesse Dylan: Yogurt, more
culture than the entire city.

00:27:15.334 --> 00:27:16.995
Uh, I was there when the
whole city was drunk.

00:27:17.635 --> 00:27:18.955
Drunk all the time.

00:27:18.955 --> 00:27:19.395
All the time.

00:27:19.395 --> 00:27:20.459
Jim Conrad: Well, what
else do you do in it?

00:27:20.459 --> 00:27:22.280
Jesse Dylan: Because 630CHED, 53 share.

00:27:22.499 --> 00:27:26.709
They had so much contra at bars we
had to go out and drink and eat.

00:27:26.790 --> 00:27:28.530
We had to go out and
try and use the contra.

00:27:28.570 --> 00:27:29.639
'Cause it drove them nuts.

00:27:30.239 --> 00:27:31.679
They were losing the contra battle.

00:27:32.129 --> 00:27:32.610
So anyway.

00:27:32.850 --> 00:27:33.959
Jim Conrad: Edmonton back to Vancouver.

00:27:33.965 --> 00:27:36.679
Jesse Dylan: Uh uh, was out
here on holidays, CGOR was

00:27:36.679 --> 00:27:37.929
gonna take a run at CKNW.

00:27:37.949 --> 00:27:41.129
They were looking for a guy that sounded
like Rick Honey to do the afternoon show.

00:27:41.129 --> 00:27:42.929
They offered it to me,
gave me a lot more money.

00:27:42.959 --> 00:27:43.499
I took it.

00:27:43.889 --> 00:27:46.409
I moved to, uh, the coast, CGOR.

00:27:47.549 --> 00:27:50.540
They weren't successful
going up against CKNW.

00:27:50.540 --> 00:27:54.540
They tried, but they had, you know, Frosty
in the morning who'd been there forever.

00:27:54.629 --> 00:27:56.159
You know, CGOR brought in some heavies.

00:27:56.159 --> 00:27:57.270
Man, they had Jack Webster.

00:27:57.480 --> 00:28:00.480
Jim Conrad: It's because of CJOR
that made NW that much more better.

00:28:00.485 --> 00:28:01.709
That, that much more better.

00:28:01.709 --> 00:28:02.280
That much better.

00:28:02.280 --> 00:28:02.850
Jesse Dylan: I'll count you in.

00:28:02.970 --> 00:28:03.750
We're gonna do that again.

00:28:04.350 --> 00:28:06.300
3, 2, 1.

00:28:07.629 --> 00:28:10.659
Jim Conrad: It was because
of CJOR, uh, and what they

00:28:10.659 --> 00:28:11.470
were trying to do, which was.

00:28:11.470 --> 00:28:11.679
Jesse Dylan: I'm sorry.

00:28:11.830 --> 00:28:13.179
No, we're gonna, we're
gonna do that again.

00:28:13.540 --> 00:28:16.480
I'm gonna count you in and, and this
time we'll put a little music behind it.

00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:17.360
Softer read.

00:28:17.360 --> 00:28:18.159
Come closer to the mic.

00:28:19.120 --> 00:28:19.419
Okay.

00:28:19.750 --> 00:28:21.610
This is for Dania Down Quilts.

00:28:21.760 --> 00:28:25.480
I want you to tell the CJOR story, but
as if you're seducing somebody to get on

00:28:25.480 --> 00:28:27.040
a Dania Down Quilt and it's nighttime.

00:28:27.429 --> 00:28:29.230
In 3 2 1.

00:28:29.800 --> 00:28:35.929
Jim Conrad: CJOR because of their
competitiveness made NW better.

00:28:36.110 --> 00:28:37.909
Jesse Dylan: Would it be untoward
to whack off to your voice.

00:28:38.689 --> 00:28:40.009
Jim Conrad: When traffic's slow, I do.

00:28:42.709 --> 00:28:44.399
Jesse Dylan: Jim and I
have faces for radio.

00:28:44.810 --> 00:28:45.770
We digress though.

00:28:46.270 --> 00:28:47.679
Lovely Family story going.

00:28:47.749 --> 00:28:49.639
Jim Conrad: There's, there
were some legends around OR,

00:28:49.639 --> 00:28:51.139
and that includes Pat Burns.

00:28:51.199 --> 00:28:51.979
Jesse Dylan: Oh, fuck.

00:28:52.249 --> 00:28:53.239
I can't tell that story.

00:28:53.449 --> 00:28:54.709
You know what, that's
the only radio story.

00:28:54.735 --> 00:28:54.894
Jim Conrad: Okay.

00:28:54.894 --> 00:28:57.769
Can you tell that story in a way
that you're not telling the story?

00:28:57.830 --> 00:28:58.159
Jesse Dylan: Okay.

00:28:58.569 --> 00:29:00.060
So CJOR.

00:29:00.079 --> 00:29:01.309
I'm their version of Rick Honey.

00:29:01.620 --> 00:29:02.440
God rest his soul.

00:29:02.669 --> 00:29:04.840
So anyway, good afternoon.

00:29:04.939 --> 00:29:07.789
And my name at the time
was Steve Woodman Jr.

00:29:07.879 --> 00:29:08.449
Jim Conrad: Nice.

00:29:08.479 --> 00:29:09.139
Nice tribute.

00:29:09.239 --> 00:29:09.729
Jesse Dylan: Thank you.

00:29:10.239 --> 00:29:13.519
So when my father passed away, not
only did I steal everything that he

00:29:13.639 --> 00:29:16.304
previously owned, but I, I took the name.

00:29:17.019 --> 00:29:19.179
Jim Conrad: Pat Burns and
you're, uh, doing a crossover.

00:29:19.179 --> 00:29:22.149
It's the end of your show, Pat's show's
about to begin, and you're doing a

00:29:22.149 --> 00:29:23.860
two mic crossover with Pat Burns.

00:29:23.889 --> 00:29:24.039
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:29:24.129 --> 00:29:28.439
And a crossover for the uninitiated is
when I'm finishing a show and the next

00:29:28.439 --> 00:29:30.199
guy coming on and you do this thing.

00:29:30.269 --> 00:29:31.770
so it's like 5:55.

00:29:31.770 --> 00:29:32.520
I'm Steve Woodman.

00:29:32.520 --> 00:29:39.639
CJOR in Vancouver.

00:29:39.840 --> 00:29:44.475
Some fucking advertising
genius came up with that, CJOR.

00:29:44.495 --> 00:29:51.004
We, the one, So, CJOR, oh are we the one.

00:29:51.004 --> 00:29:52.884
How fucking genius is that?

00:29:54.084 --> 00:29:56.674
Every time I said it, I wanna
stab myself in the, the needle.

00:29:59.194 --> 00:30:00.554
I'm doing the crossover.

00:30:00.554 --> 00:30:01.514
It's 5:55.

00:30:01.534 --> 00:30:02.284
I'm Steve Woodman.

00:30:02.284 --> 00:30:02.985
CJOR.

00:30:03.004 --> 00:30:04.654
Oh, are we the one.

00:30:05.429 --> 00:30:06.779
Hey Pat, what's on the show tonight?

00:30:07.110 --> 00:30:09.419
I'm just coming off of
like Barry Manalow, right?

00:30:09.449 --> 00:30:11.370
Pat Burns comes in, he's
got a styrofoam cup.

00:30:11.519 --> 00:30:14.620
He's about four and a half feet
tall, greasy, dandruff ridden

00:30:14.669 --> 00:30:16.229
hair, came out of a little room.

00:30:16.259 --> 00:30:18.749
I think it was a closet that they
had turned into the Pat Burns office.

00:30:18.779 --> 00:30:20.879
And the reason they gave him his
own office is 'cause he drinks.

00:30:21.209 --> 00:30:22.399
All day and all night.

00:30:22.929 --> 00:30:24.709
So anyway, what's on the show Pat?

00:30:24.870 --> 00:30:28.145
He's got the Vancouver Province or the
Vancouver Sun, I can't remember which, and

00:30:28.145 --> 00:30:32.885
the headline said, racism, parenthetically
below, tearing this province apart.

00:30:32.945 --> 00:30:33.875
So Pat comes in.

00:30:33.875 --> 00:30:35.465
I said, Hey Pat, what's on the show today?

00:30:35.585 --> 00:30:38.554
Well, Steve, after the blah,
blah, blah, blah, blah, headline's

00:30:38.554 --> 00:30:39.514
in the Province newspaper.

00:30:40.080 --> 00:30:41.089
You know how he talk, right?

00:30:41.089 --> 00:30:41.929
Pat Burns.

00:30:41.929 --> 00:30:43.109
I'm Pat Burns.

00:30:43.169 --> 00:30:45.929
Steve, headlines in the province
today, racism is tearing

00:30:45.929 --> 00:30:47.459
this, this province apart.

00:30:47.969 --> 00:30:50.939
I'm all for getting
racism outta the province.

00:30:50.939 --> 00:30:52.359
And he's on and off the mic, right?

00:30:52.359 --> 00:30:56.939
I'm all for getting racism out of the
province, but before we do that, we

00:30:56.939 --> 00:31:03.060
gotta get the and the, and the, and
the, and he just kept going on and on.

00:31:03.379 --> 00:31:08.264
Dude, I'm telling you, I can't say
those, I can't say those words today.

00:31:09.145 --> 00:31:13.624
But he did and, and it must have
been like 20 of them, 20 slangs for,

00:31:13.684 --> 00:31:14.854
fuck, it must have been every nation.

00:31:14.914 --> 00:31:15.844
Jim Conrad: Racial epithets.

00:31:15.924 --> 00:31:16.654
Jesse Dylan: Oh, it's horrible.

00:31:17.074 --> 00:31:20.674
And, and he's, and then he ends it by
saying, we gotta get racism outta here.

00:31:20.674 --> 00:31:24.245
But we can't until we get those
people the fuck out of this province.

00:31:24.274 --> 00:31:24.874
I'm Pat Burns.

00:31:24.874 --> 00:31:30.654
I'll see you in 35 minutes.

00:31:31.374 --> 00:31:31.945
How old am I?

00:31:31.945 --> 00:31:34.570
22, 24? I don't, 23?

00:31:34.840 --> 00:31:36.679
I haven't been in the
business that long full time.

00:31:36.829 --> 00:31:38.359
It's kind of my first major market.

00:31:38.359 --> 00:31:39.979
Sure there was Edmonton,
but that's a mistake.

00:31:40.399 --> 00:31:43.489
And now I'm in Vancouver and
I sat there with my mouth open

00:31:43.489 --> 00:31:45.199
thinking there goes my career.

00:31:45.769 --> 00:31:46.350
I'm done.

00:31:48.199 --> 00:31:49.409
This is 1980.

00:31:49.429 --> 00:31:50.929
The news guys didn't say rape.

00:31:51.429 --> 00:31:53.029
Jim, we didn't say rape on the air.

00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:58.419
This guy just went through every
fucking horrible, as you say, racial

00:31:58.419 --> 00:31:59.499
epithet, I would've said another word.

00:32:00.359 --> 00:32:01.489
And so I, I, I don't know.

00:32:01.504 --> 00:32:02.749
It, it felt like an eternity.

00:32:02.749 --> 00:32:06.349
And, and finally the next thing you
heard on CJOR was, here's the Eagles.

00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:07.339
I'm Steve Woodman.

00:32:07.609 --> 00:32:08.239
Film at 11.

00:32:08.599 --> 00:32:09.439
And you know what?

00:32:09.709 --> 00:32:11.759
Not a single fucking complaint.

00:32:12.149 --> 00:32:15.409
Not management, not program
director, not a call.

00:32:15.409 --> 00:32:16.249
And we had listeners.

00:32:16.249 --> 00:32:17.659
Jim Conrad: Did anybody mention it?

00:32:19.539 --> 00:32:19.859
Jesse Dylan: No.

00:32:20.249 --> 00:32:21.179
No one.

00:32:21.629 --> 00:32:23.149
And that was the weirdest thing, right?

00:32:23.149 --> 00:32:23.539
It's like,

00:32:23.600 --> 00:32:25.219
Jim Conrad: The silence is
another story, isn't it?

00:32:25.249 --> 00:32:25.639
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:32:25.789 --> 00:32:26.809
We had listeners at the time.

00:32:26.809 --> 00:32:29.110
Yeah, we had listeners,
CJOR had lots of listeners.

00:32:29.110 --> 00:32:34.189
After CJOR, they decided
to, uh, fuck, I don't know.

00:32:34.249 --> 00:32:36.919
I think they went news, I
think they went news 24/7.

00:32:37.219 --> 00:32:40.909
They were like NW two for a little
while, and then they decided to go news.

00:32:40.969 --> 00:32:42.499
They offered me a position to do news.

00:32:42.499 --> 00:32:43.669
Can you imagine me doing news?

00:32:43.909 --> 00:32:45.159
Jim Conrad: Well, maybe, Les Nessman.

00:32:45.365 --> 00:32:46.655
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, now
it wouldn't work for me.

00:32:47.865 --> 00:32:50.314
Les Nessman and more music on CJOR.

00:32:50.945 --> 00:32:51.905
Oh, are we the one.

00:32:52.475 --> 00:32:55.625
Uh, it's funny, we only have white people
listening to us now after that last

00:32:55.625 --> 00:32:59.735
break, but we've lost 75% of our audience.

00:32:59.975 --> 00:33:00.544
Thank you, Pat.

00:33:00.550 --> 00:33:00.899
Bye-bye.

00:33:01.205 --> 00:33:02.495
You've cleansed the cube Pat.

00:33:03.215 --> 00:33:03.754
Well done.

00:33:04.084 --> 00:33:05.524
One fell swoop gone.

00:33:05.814 --> 00:33:08.764
Why did we go from a seven
share to a 0.5 share?

00:33:09.205 --> 00:33:09.835
Two words.

00:33:09.865 --> 00:33:10.585
That motherfucker,

00:33:12.895 --> 00:33:14.425
he's in the styrofoam office drinking.

00:33:14.875 --> 00:33:15.294
It's him.

00:33:15.475 --> 00:33:20.885
I had an offer to go to
Kelowna or Toronto, CFTR.

00:33:25.585 --> 00:33:27.445
And Toronto was a big top 40 station.

00:33:27.635 --> 00:33:28.975
Jim Conrad: Kelowna is a step down.

00:33:29.165 --> 00:33:30.925
Toronto was a, is a step up.

00:33:30.985 --> 00:33:32.245
Jesse Dylan: Oh God bless you, Jim.

00:33:32.245 --> 00:33:33.774
Everybody listening in Kelowna right now.

00:33:34.384 --> 00:33:36.209
They think they've landed and
gone to heaven and now you,

00:33:36.449 --> 00:33:37.834
Jim Conrad: Compared
to Toronto, of course.

00:33:37.834 --> 00:33:38.465
Jesse Dylan: Hey, where do you look?

00:33:38.465 --> 00:33:39.664
Jim Conrad: People in Kelowna
would agree with that.

00:33:39.664 --> 00:33:41.134
Jesse Dylan: I, I'm Anthony Von Mandel.

00:33:41.284 --> 00:33:42.725
I, I own Mission Hills.

00:33:43.144 --> 00:33:45.274
Did you know that you're
living in a step down.

00:33:45.424 --> 00:33:47.014
You stupid fuck.

00:33:48.154 --> 00:33:48.995
What were you thinking?

00:33:49.534 --> 00:33:51.904
You rich, billionaire
bastards are all the same.

00:33:53.104 --> 00:33:54.664
I had an offer to go to Toronto.

00:33:54.935 --> 00:33:55.804
I was gonna take it.

00:33:56.074 --> 00:33:57.844
It was uh, CFTR.

00:33:58.235 --> 00:34:04.445
So CFTR and CHUM were the LG
and CFUN in the big smoke.

00:34:04.445 --> 00:34:05.365
I was gonna take it.

00:34:05.585 --> 00:34:07.895
Then he called me back
to say, I'm really sorry.

00:34:07.924 --> 00:34:14.165
Our swing guy, which we were gonna give
to you, has decided to stay and, or the

00:34:14.165 --> 00:34:15.665
all night guy we're moving up to swing.

00:34:15.665 --> 00:34:17.255
So now we've only got the all night show.

00:34:17.255 --> 00:34:21.074
And Sandy Sanderson, president of
program for Rogers and he said, uh,

00:34:21.194 --> 00:34:22.334
you know, you're better than that.

00:34:22.334 --> 00:34:23.504
I can't put you on the all night show.

00:34:23.864 --> 00:34:27.794
So I took the gig in Kelowna,
but to pay me enough to make a

00:34:27.794 --> 00:34:29.324
living, I was the morning man.

00:34:29.475 --> 00:34:30.794
I got a small salary for that.

00:34:30.854 --> 00:34:32.205
I was the promotion director.

00:34:32.584 --> 00:34:34.774
I never did anything
for them in that regard.

00:34:34.774 --> 00:34:38.704
But I got a small salary for that
and I was the music director and

00:34:38.704 --> 00:34:39.874
I got a small salary for that.

00:34:39.874 --> 00:34:43.114
So I got three salaries and I did the
morning show in Kelowna for almost four

00:34:43.114 --> 00:34:45.844
years at, uh, FM 104.7, which is out.

00:34:45.844 --> 00:34:45.994
Jim Conrad: All right.

00:34:45.994 --> 00:34:49.705
So you paid your dues, uh, doing
everything at a radio station?

00:34:49.745 --> 00:34:49.984
Okay.

00:34:49.984 --> 00:34:50.764
Not a step down.

00:34:51.124 --> 00:34:52.024
I take that back.

00:34:54.034 --> 00:34:56.534
Jesse Dylan: In terms of market size,
you are correct from Vancouver to

00:34:56.534 --> 00:34:58.055
Kelowna is not up, and that's what I did.

00:34:58.140 --> 00:34:58.920
Jim Conrad: Of course you did.

00:34:58.980 --> 00:34:59.129
Yeah.

00:34:59.279 --> 00:35:00.420
And then what happened?

00:35:00.690 --> 00:35:01.500
Jesse Dylan: We're going to Calgary.

00:35:01.560 --> 00:35:02.580
Do you know why we're gonna Calgary?

00:35:02.580 --> 00:35:03.330
Jim Conrad: Why we're gonna Calgary?

00:35:03.330 --> 00:35:04.980
Jesse Dylan: Because we can't
go anywhere else in Alberta.

00:35:05.220 --> 00:35:07.500
God shit all over the bushes
and the people in Edmonton.

00:35:08.190 --> 00:35:09.180
So that leaves Calgary.

00:35:09.540 --> 00:35:10.350
So I went to Calgary.

00:35:10.799 --> 00:35:14.700
I was in the CFCN building
that housed CFCN TV.

00:35:14.979 --> 00:35:16.089
Did some of that by the way.

00:35:16.089 --> 00:35:16.600
It was fun.

00:35:16.810 --> 00:35:16.899
Jim Conrad: Right.

00:35:16.899 --> 00:35:17.290
What year?

00:35:17.589 --> 00:35:20.229
Jesse Dylan: Oh, this was, uh, 84.

00:35:20.439 --> 00:35:22.479
So I left Kelowna, got an offer.

00:35:22.600 --> 00:35:23.770
Dave Charles, you know the name?

00:35:23.950 --> 00:35:24.339
Jim Conrad: Heard it.

00:35:24.399 --> 00:35:25.720
Jesse Dylan: They were looking
for a morning guy to sign

00:35:25.720 --> 00:35:26.649
on this new radio station.

00:35:26.649 --> 00:35:29.890
He said, Steve Woodman's doing,
you know, mornings in Kelowna.

00:35:29.890 --> 00:35:30.640
He's what you want.

00:35:30.640 --> 00:35:31.299
They hired me.

00:35:31.359 --> 00:35:32.140
I went to Calgary.

00:35:32.140 --> 00:35:32.890
It was really fun.

00:35:33.490 --> 00:35:34.899
Calgary was really fun for two years.

00:35:34.959 --> 00:35:35.589
Yeah, it really was.

00:35:35.589 --> 00:35:36.549
And I was on the ski team.

00:35:36.549 --> 00:35:37.330
Jim Conrad: Got a cowboy hat.

00:35:37.569 --> 00:35:37.839
Jesse Dylan: Yep.

00:35:37.839 --> 00:35:38.439
Cowboy hat.

00:35:38.439 --> 00:35:38.849
I was,

00:35:40.929 --> 00:35:41.909
Lake Louise.

00:35:42.749 --> 00:35:45.649
Sunshine, uh, panorama,
kimberly, all that stuff.

00:35:45.649 --> 00:35:45.830
Jim Conrad: Perfect.

00:35:45.830 --> 00:35:46.310
Yeah.

00:35:46.310 --> 00:35:46.320
Yeah.

00:35:46.459 --> 00:35:47.120
What a gig.

00:35:47.209 --> 00:35:49.430
Jesse Dylan: But you know, the funny
thing is we, I get in the van, it's

00:35:49.430 --> 00:35:52.700
like nine o'clock in the morning,
we're off to Lake Louise for an outing

00:35:52.700 --> 00:35:56.580
with the radio stations and, uh,
they got beers, coolers, and beers.

00:35:56.609 --> 00:35:57.799
And they say, you want a roadie?

00:35:59.299 --> 00:35:59.689
Okay.

00:36:00.259 --> 00:36:01.129
So we're drinking beer.

00:36:01.589 --> 00:36:02.220
Roadies.

00:36:02.309 --> 00:36:07.049
In Alberta back in the days you
drank, and it's, I know it's horrible.

00:36:07.049 --> 00:36:07.350
Right?

00:36:07.559 --> 00:36:09.870
And I'm not recommending
this at all for anyone.

00:36:09.959 --> 00:36:10.499
I'm with MAAD.

00:36:10.799 --> 00:36:11.929
I'm with everybody on this, right?

00:36:11.929 --> 00:36:13.079
You do not drink and drive.

00:36:13.629 --> 00:36:20.640
But in 1984 in Calgary, I got in
a, in a vehicle with the ski team.

00:36:20.879 --> 00:36:22.109
Nice young men and women.

00:36:22.134 --> 00:36:25.944
Clean cut, well-spoken fit,
and they said, Hey, road pops.

00:36:26.004 --> 00:36:26.274
Jim Conrad: Yeah.

00:36:26.395 --> 00:36:28.194
So, uh, but you get there, you ski.

00:36:28.194 --> 00:36:28.825
Have fun.

00:36:28.915 --> 00:36:29.964
Two years in Calgary.

00:36:30.294 --> 00:36:32.274
Any great stories from Calgary?

00:36:32.455 --> 00:36:34.555
Jesse Dylan: There's a, there's some,
there's some stories from Calgary.

00:36:34.615 --> 00:36:35.484
You want, you don't wanna hear one.

00:36:35.754 --> 00:36:35.964
Okay.

00:36:35.964 --> 00:36:36.924
I'll tell you, I'll tell you a story.

00:36:36.924 --> 00:36:37.765
I won't mention names.

00:36:38.095 --> 00:36:42.154
The program director and I, we're friends
when I was doing the morning show.

00:36:42.205 --> 00:36:44.125
Steve Woodman on AM 106.

00:36:44.125 --> 00:36:44.825
That was the new station.

00:36:44.845 --> 00:36:46.015
We did really well by the way.

00:36:46.194 --> 00:36:48.595
And I was doing the morning
show and I had a good team

00:36:48.595 --> 00:36:49.884
around me and I was the anchor.

00:36:50.260 --> 00:36:53.740
And then program director at the
time and his wife and my wife

00:36:54.100 --> 00:36:55.210
thought it'd be fun to be friends.

00:36:55.300 --> 00:36:56.260
So we partied together.

00:36:56.260 --> 00:36:57.010
We'd go to his house.

00:36:57.010 --> 00:36:57.670
He'd come to our house.

00:36:57.670 --> 00:36:58.430
We're a pretty good pals.

00:36:58.630 --> 00:37:02.740
And so, um, one day my buddies
says, wouldn't it be fun to

00:37:02.740 --> 00:37:04.060
do a two man morning show?

00:37:04.270 --> 00:37:05.510
The program director says that?

00:37:06.080 --> 00:37:07.990
On paper it's a conflict of interest.

00:37:08.080 --> 00:37:10.270
'Cause this is the guy that's
supposed to be telling me how to

00:37:10.270 --> 00:37:11.770
sound and what's funny and what's not.

00:37:11.800 --> 00:37:12.850
Jim Conrad: But he wants
to be on the air with you.

00:37:12.850 --> 00:37:13.970
Jesse Dylan: Now he wants
to be on the air with me.

00:37:14.569 --> 00:37:15.829
So we do a two man show.

00:37:16.009 --> 00:37:19.579
It's now somebody and Steve
where it was the Steve Show.

00:37:19.609 --> 00:37:20.539
Now it's somebody and Steve.

00:37:20.850 --> 00:37:21.720
It was fun, right?

00:37:21.720 --> 00:37:22.190
We get along.

00:37:22.190 --> 00:37:22.910
We had a good time.

00:37:22.910 --> 00:37:24.079
I thought the show was really fun.

00:37:24.109 --> 00:37:27.799
He and I had similar senses of humor,
twisted, and then Dave Charles comes

00:37:27.799 --> 00:37:32.149
to town and he told Vince Dimaggio and
some of the other people that would

00:37:32.149 --> 00:37:36.410
listen that the show's gone downhill
since it's been a two-man show.

00:37:36.499 --> 00:37:39.615
Get that motherfucker off the
air back in programming full

00:37:39.615 --> 00:37:41.475
time and let Steve do his thing.

00:37:41.755 --> 00:37:42.575
So they did that?

00:37:42.625 --> 00:37:46.515
They pulled so and so off the air and
suddenly everything that we were doing

00:37:46.515 --> 00:37:52.095
one week that was funny and great
and cool is now not funny, not great.

00:37:52.185 --> 00:37:52.785
It's shit.

00:37:53.024 --> 00:37:56.325
And the bitterness I suppose,
that he must have had was,

00:37:56.325 --> 00:37:58.694
Jim Conrad: But it was the consultant,
it was Darth Vader coming in.

00:37:58.694 --> 00:37:59.995
Jesse Dylan: It doesn't matter.

00:38:00.024 --> 00:38:02.325
Somehow that happened.

00:38:02.654 --> 00:38:03.765
He made it horrible for me.

00:38:03.765 --> 00:38:06.405
It's, and I, I was, I was
enjoying Calgary a lot till then.

00:38:06.935 --> 00:38:10.545
So I phoned Gary Slate who was the
program director, Q107 Toronto.

00:38:10.635 --> 00:38:11.895
I said, I'd like to come and work for you.

00:38:12.075 --> 00:38:13.155
He said, are you any good?

00:38:13.455 --> 00:38:14.595
I said, yeah, I'm really good.

00:38:14.655 --> 00:38:17.055
He said, can you overnight me a tape?

00:38:17.385 --> 00:38:19.665
And uh, a couple of days later,
he called me and said, I'd

00:38:19.665 --> 00:38:20.865
like to fly you out to Toronto.

00:38:21.145 --> 00:38:23.299
Gave me the gig, said, You
have to change your name.

00:38:23.660 --> 00:38:25.069
I said, what's wrong with Steve Woodman?

00:38:25.430 --> 00:38:27.229
He said, it's a nowhere
not happening name.

00:38:29.330 --> 00:38:32.060
He said, the creative director,
Dave Barker will meet you tomorrow

00:38:32.089 --> 00:38:32.990
and you'll pick a new name.

00:38:33.309 --> 00:38:35.120
I'm thinking, what's
wrong with Steve Woodman?

00:38:35.330 --> 00:38:36.560
I ripped it off from my dad.

00:38:37.040 --> 00:38:39.890
So Dave Barker, the creative
director, super nice guy, but

00:38:39.890 --> 00:38:40.850
crazier than a shithouse rat.

00:38:41.060 --> 00:38:42.830
Jim Conrad: So this was your
name change was a meeting.

00:38:43.145 --> 00:38:44.825
Jesse Dylan: No, it was
a vision from Jesus.

00:38:47.404 --> 00:38:48.334
Yeah, it was a meeting.

00:38:48.725 --> 00:38:49.174
Fuck.

00:38:50.165 --> 00:38:51.034
I'm trying to work with you.

00:38:52.095 --> 00:38:53.915
So Dave Barker, the creative director.

00:38:54.004 --> 00:38:56.175
I just wanted to reiterate this
'cause I don't think you heard it.

00:38:56.575 --> 00:38:59.884
Nice guy, but crazier
than a shit house rat.

00:39:00.185 --> 00:39:01.504
My hope is he hears this someday.

00:39:01.774 --> 00:39:02.105
Okay.

00:39:02.225 --> 00:39:02.435
Okay.

00:39:02.855 --> 00:39:07.064
Here's a list of 12 first names,
Jesse or Steve, whatever my name was.

00:39:07.754 --> 00:39:09.334
Here's a list of 12 last names.

00:39:09.334 --> 00:39:11.825
By the way, I've been, I've
been Jesse Dylan longer in my

00:39:11.825 --> 00:39:13.254
life than I was Steve Woodman.

00:39:13.325 --> 00:39:15.014
Jim Conrad: So you're Steve Woodman.

00:39:15.365 --> 00:39:17.975
You get first names and
last names on a list.

00:39:17.979 --> 00:39:21.005
Jesse Dylan: And the lists are McLovesit.

00:39:22.055 --> 00:39:22.924
Mudcat.

00:39:23.015 --> 00:39:23.884
Derringer.

00:39:24.995 --> 00:39:28.285
And I hated them all with the
exception of the first list.

00:39:28.285 --> 00:39:31.685
Which had the names Jesse and Dylan.

00:39:32.875 --> 00:39:35.240
And I thought, well, I like
Jesse and I like Dylan.

00:39:35.240 --> 00:39:35.690
Jim Conrad: Jesse James.

00:39:35.690 --> 00:39:36.260
Jesse Dylan: Oh, strong.

00:39:36.260 --> 00:39:36.320
Yeah.

00:39:36.500 --> 00:39:36.920
Dylan.

00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:37.880
Good names Dylan Rock.

00:39:37.880 --> 00:39:39.290
Dylan Thomas the poet.

00:39:39.715 --> 00:39:40.295
Bob Dylan.

00:39:40.295 --> 00:39:40.550
Bob Dylan.

00:39:40.580 --> 00:39:40.970
Yeah.

00:39:41.150 --> 00:39:44.300
So I said, Hey, uh, can
I have two first names?

00:39:44.390 --> 00:39:45.200
What are you thinking?

00:39:45.530 --> 00:39:48.430
Well, I was thinking either
Dylan Jesse or Jesse Dylan.

00:39:48.800 --> 00:39:48.920
Yeah.

00:39:48.920 --> 00:39:51.560
I like Jesse Dylan has a
nice iambic pentameter to it.

00:39:51.590 --> 00:39:52.435
Go with Jesse Dylan.

00:39:52.565 --> 00:39:58.305
So September 6th, 1986
I became Jesse Dylan.

00:39:58.640 --> 00:40:03.049
And the news guy at Q107 was Gene Vilitus.

00:40:03.049 --> 00:40:05.120
And he was doing news
and he was very straight.

00:40:05.299 --> 00:40:09.440
And they thought that Jesse
and Gene would work out.

00:40:10.009 --> 00:40:11.540
First 10 weeks on the air was horrible.

00:40:11.630 --> 00:40:12.690
Absolutely fucking horrible.

00:40:13.500 --> 00:40:15.950
Well, first of all, Gene has a
head the size of a cement mixer.

00:40:16.009 --> 00:40:16.819
He's Lithuanian.

00:40:16.910 --> 00:40:20.720
Jim Conrad: I've been sitting next to Gene
and his head, it's huge, many, many times.

00:40:20.750 --> 00:40:25.069
Jesse Dylan: And he's got this
very stoic, pierced lip thing going

00:40:25.069 --> 00:40:26.720
on where he almost never smiles.

00:40:27.120 --> 00:40:31.410
And also the other thing was they
called me Huey Lewis, hip to be square.

00:40:31.500 --> 00:40:33.690
'Cause even though I did acid and
all that stuff, when I was young,

00:40:33.750 --> 00:40:36.210
I got myself in shape when we moved
to Kelowna, I lost the weight.

00:40:36.210 --> 00:40:40.810
I started running, doing triathlons,
marathons, and now I'm at Q107,

00:40:40.830 --> 00:40:42.120
which is the hippest place, right?

00:40:42.120 --> 00:40:45.540
There's a lot of cocaine going on and
a lot of rock bands, you know, Rush.

00:40:45.750 --> 00:40:47.880
We all wanted to be.

00:40:48.040 --> 00:40:49.799
Everybody's living the
rock and roll lifestyle.

00:40:49.859 --> 00:40:50.939
Everyone except me.

00:40:50.939 --> 00:40:51.990
I'm, I'm kind of straight.

00:40:52.379 --> 00:40:53.910
Jim Conrad: Well, to do a
morning show as well, right?

00:40:53.970 --> 00:40:54.600
Jesse Dylan: Yeah, yeah.

00:40:54.600 --> 00:40:56.370
Jim Conrad: You need stamina and
you need to be able to get up early.

00:40:56.430 --> 00:41:00.180
Jesse Dylan: So my nickname was
Huey Lewis, hip to be square.

00:41:00.180 --> 00:41:00.569
Thank you.

00:41:00.600 --> 00:41:01.509
Thank you for drawing that up.

00:41:02.059 --> 00:41:03.959
I should have, I'm
remiss in not doing that.

00:41:04.649 --> 00:41:07.899
I'll punish myself tonight when
I'm in the tub with Mr. Bubbles.

00:41:08.679 --> 00:41:09.139
Thank you.

00:41:09.309 --> 00:41:11.459
A little lower, Bob.

00:41:11.850 --> 00:41:12.390
Jim Conrad: Don't try.

00:41:12.620 --> 00:41:13.609
Don't, don't go too low.

00:41:13.640 --> 00:41:17.000
If you try to go too low and
it's not natural, Jess, your

00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:19.129
testicle can actually explode.

00:41:20.480 --> 00:41:20.839
Jesse Dylan: Thank you.

00:41:21.410 --> 00:41:23.000
My wife has seen that happen.

00:41:23.800 --> 00:41:27.200
So anyway, I'm, I'm on the
air 10 weeks Q107, 10 weeks.

00:41:27.200 --> 00:41:28.339
Jesse and Gene was horrible.

00:41:28.700 --> 00:41:32.550
It was my dream gig of being in
the biggest smoke in the country.

00:41:32.700 --> 00:41:36.890
And being the quarterback for the radio
station, the morning guy was failing.

00:41:38.855 --> 00:41:40.295
Failing worse than, oh are we the one.

00:41:40.565 --> 00:41:42.965
Gary Slate pulls me in the
office about 10 weeks in.

00:41:43.025 --> 00:41:44.015
I know he's gonna fire me.

00:41:44.075 --> 00:41:44.465
And you know what?

00:41:44.465 --> 00:41:45.005
I deserved it.

00:41:45.035 --> 00:41:45.545
It was horrible.

00:41:45.635 --> 00:41:46.085
It was bad.

00:41:46.505 --> 00:41:47.585
Even by my standards.

00:41:48.005 --> 00:41:51.545
I'm sure there was some modicum
of professionalism 'cause I

00:41:51.545 --> 00:41:53.945
had a nice voice and I knew the
format and I played the music.

00:41:54.095 --> 00:41:57.485
We got the weather in the news on
time, but there was no entertainment.

00:41:57.605 --> 00:42:01.265
So I got, I went into his office and
then he said, what happened to the

00:42:01.265 --> 00:42:02.945
guy on the air check that I hired?

00:42:03.120 --> 00:42:03.780
Where's that guy?

00:42:04.050 --> 00:42:05.670
I said, dude, I don't blame you.

00:42:05.925 --> 00:42:06.720
I, I don't know.

00:42:06.720 --> 00:42:07.410
We're not gelling.

00:42:07.410 --> 00:42:09.690
There's something, you know, I look
at this guy and it looks like he

00:42:09.690 --> 00:42:12.780
hates me and he's reading the fucking
newspaper while I'm trying to do a

00:42:12.780 --> 00:42:16.440
bit, and the show's going nowhere
and the plane is in a death spiral.

00:42:16.440 --> 00:42:18.690
And honestly, Gary, I don't
know how to pull it out.

00:42:18.750 --> 00:42:20.310
So if you're firing me, I get it.

00:42:20.550 --> 00:42:21.450
I'm not firing you.

00:42:21.870 --> 00:42:25.710
He said, when was the last time,
if ever, that you and Gene went out

00:42:25.710 --> 00:42:27.330
and got high or stoned or drunk?

00:42:27.330 --> 00:42:30.660
And I said, well, we haven't yet, other
than the initial party that you threw in

00:42:30.660 --> 00:42:32.250
this office for all the jocks to meet me.

00:42:32.515 --> 00:42:35.185
He pulled out a wad of hundreds
and he gave me some of them, which

00:42:35.185 --> 00:42:36.355
was a lot of money in those days.

00:42:36.384 --> 00:42:37.525
I didn't have a wad of hundreds.

00:42:37.795 --> 00:42:42.625
And he said, take Gene out tonight and
get fucked up, get to know each other.

00:42:43.015 --> 00:42:44.095
And he said, that's an order.

00:42:44.125 --> 00:42:46.215
And if you don't do
that, I'm gonna fire you.

00:42:46.295 --> 00:42:48.535
So I phoned Gene, I said,
Hey, we're going out tonight.

00:42:49.105 --> 00:42:50.695
I can't, you know, Kathleen.

00:42:50.755 --> 00:42:52.375
I said, yeah, you're coming with me.

00:42:52.435 --> 00:42:53.965
I just left Gary Slate's office.

00:42:53.965 --> 00:42:55.495
He gave me a bunch of a
hundred dollars bills.

00:42:55.525 --> 00:42:57.865
And he said, you and I are going
out tonight to get fucked up.

00:42:57.955 --> 00:43:00.595
And if we don't, we're both
fired tomorrow morning.

00:43:00.715 --> 00:43:01.285
Where do you wanna meet?

00:43:01.910 --> 00:43:03.200
It became a regular occurrence.

00:43:03.200 --> 00:43:08.240
We got drunk out of our fucking skulls,
and then some, and I think we were

00:43:08.240 --> 00:43:09.770
still hammered the next day on the air.

00:43:09.859 --> 00:43:12.080
I spent everything he gave me, and it
was a lot of money back in the day.

00:43:12.200 --> 00:43:12.319
Right?

00:43:12.410 --> 00:43:14.629
The next show was one of the best
shows I've ever done in my life.

00:43:14.750 --> 00:43:17.359
I correct myself, one of the best
shows we've ever done in our life.

00:43:17.720 --> 00:43:21.439
Jesse and Gene were born at 10
weeks and one day in, and then

00:43:21.439 --> 00:43:22.640
we took the market by storm.

00:43:22.669 --> 00:43:26.000
The station's highest quarter
hours were about 70,000.

00:43:26.540 --> 00:43:30.290
Within six months, we were
now at 140,000 quarter hours.

00:43:30.569 --> 00:43:33.689
A neck and neck with Roger, Rick,
and Marilyn at CHUM Stations.

00:43:33.689 --> 00:43:35.850
You know, two, we were
like 12 and a half share.

00:43:35.850 --> 00:43:39.060
I think at the time each SharePoint
in Toronto was worth 2 million.

00:43:39.060 --> 00:43:42.240
So the morning shows building
around 25 million a year.

00:43:42.629 --> 00:43:43.680
We were the talk of the town.

00:43:43.740 --> 00:43:47.339
Jim Conrad: Tell me the story about being,
you had a bit about wrecking weddings and

00:43:47.339 --> 00:43:49.140
then you got sued by the Catholic church.

00:43:49.410 --> 00:43:51.779
Jesse Dylan: Our most popular feature
was called Wreck a Wedding Wednesday.

00:43:52.350 --> 00:43:53.279
Let's say it together, Jim.

00:43:53.399 --> 00:43:55.919
Wreck a Wedding Wednesday.

00:43:56.509 --> 00:43:58.460
Wreck a Wedding Wednesday
was our most popular feature.

00:43:59.250 --> 00:44:03.410
We would get faxes, phone calls,
stacks of faxes, hundreds of them.

00:44:03.410 --> 00:44:04.580
We can only do one or two a week.

00:44:05.120 --> 00:44:08.060
We did 'em on Wednesday, so
at 7:15 and 8:15, we played a

00:44:08.060 --> 00:44:09.140
Wreck a Wedding Wednesday call.

00:44:09.540 --> 00:44:10.880
Somebody would be getting married.

00:44:11.120 --> 00:44:14.390
We'd call to say that the
bridal gown burnt, the holiday's

00:44:14.390 --> 00:44:15.650
been canceled, whatever.

00:44:15.650 --> 00:44:15.920
Right?

00:44:15.920 --> 00:44:18.200
And they would have these
amazing things for us.

00:44:18.260 --> 00:44:20.835
So we used to pretend
to be Catholic priests.

00:44:20.835 --> 00:44:22.875
Not all the time, but every now and then.

00:44:22.995 --> 00:44:23.924
Phone would ring.

00:44:24.044 --> 00:44:24.975
You'd hear someone answer.

00:44:26.174 --> 00:44:26.294
Hello.

00:44:26.294 --> 00:44:27.375
And we'd say, hello.

00:44:27.375 --> 00:44:28.064
Is that Sandra?

00:44:28.125 --> 00:44:28.365
Yeah.

00:44:28.395 --> 00:44:32.774
Hi, it's Father Giuseppe and Father Gino
calling from the Archdiocese of Toronto.

00:44:32.774 --> 00:44:35.270
Yes my child and then we go into it.

00:44:35.270 --> 00:44:35.479
Right?

00:44:35.479 --> 00:44:37.490
Have you been taking
your Catholicism classes?

00:44:37.490 --> 00:44:39.950
And we know that they hadn't been
because the people that were setting

00:44:39.950 --> 00:44:43.100
them up, they were loved ones, say
they're skipping Catholicism classes.

00:44:43.134 --> 00:44:44.509
Jim Conrad: And that's
with the Catholic church.

00:44:44.509 --> 00:44:46.490
If you're wanted to be married
in the Catholic church, you

00:44:46.490 --> 00:44:48.109
had to take wedding classes.

00:44:48.109 --> 00:44:48.740
Jesse Dylan: A wedding course.

00:44:48.740 --> 00:44:49.459
Marriage classes.

00:44:49.459 --> 00:44:49.480
Marriage classes.

00:44:49.669 --> 00:44:50.149
That's right.

00:44:50.330 --> 00:44:51.740
Jim Conrad: So you're
impersonating the priests.

00:44:51.740 --> 00:44:53.009
Jesse Dylan: Yes, we did a full prank.

00:44:53.009 --> 00:44:54.799
Yeah, we did these bits that
were great, that were funny.

00:44:54.799 --> 00:44:55.729
Yeah, people loved them.

00:44:56.029 --> 00:44:57.500
We impersonate Catholic priests, so

00:44:57.500 --> 00:45:00.770
Jim Conrad: They got a bit too popular
and it became, it got on the radar.

00:45:00.799 --> 00:45:04.245
Jesse Dylan: We did one one morning, the
guy's name was Pinot and Gene saying stuff

00:45:04.245 --> 00:45:09.944
like, we can't, Sandra, we can't, wed you,
if you've seen Pinot's wino, have you?

00:45:10.360 --> 00:45:13.424
You know, of course we knew
they were sleeping together.

00:45:13.430 --> 00:45:13.520
Right?

00:45:13.700 --> 00:45:14.440
So anyway, okay.

00:45:14.540 --> 00:45:18.290
So, uh, somebody at the Archdiocese
of Toronto thought this wasn't funny.

00:45:18.290 --> 00:45:22.370
Thought we were making fun of Catholicism,
the Catholic church, priests, and they,

00:45:22.520 --> 00:45:26.440
yeah, they didn't dig it, so they sued the
radio station and it was a big lawsuit.

00:45:26.820 --> 00:45:29.660
You haven't been sued until you're
sued by the Catholic church.

00:45:29.900 --> 00:45:34.520
So the station capitulated, they said,
whatever you want, we'll hang these guys.

00:45:34.520 --> 00:45:36.770
We'll, we'll strip off their skin.

00:45:36.799 --> 00:45:38.330
We'll, whatever, whatever you need to do.

00:45:38.359 --> 00:45:39.799
Jim Conrad: Burned at the
stake at Young and Bluer.

00:45:39.830 --> 00:45:43.520
Jesse Dylan: And they said, okay,
we want a 60 second apology.

00:45:43.845 --> 00:45:48.465
Every morning right at 7:15, the
time of the incident for a month.

00:45:48.885 --> 00:45:51.405
And the radio, and we want
Jesse and Gene to do it.

00:45:51.405 --> 00:45:55.305
And the radio station said, sure, but, but
you don't want Jesse and Gene to do it.

00:45:55.305 --> 00:45:57.165
We've got a much, 'cause they
knew what would happen, right?

00:45:57.225 --> 00:45:57.285
Yeah.

00:45:57.285 --> 00:45:58.815
We turned it into a fucking live copy.

00:45:59.115 --> 00:45:59.355
Yeah.

00:45:59.505 --> 00:46:00.015
Are you kidding?

00:46:01.035 --> 00:46:02.535
We recently, we were, can you imagine?

00:46:02.625 --> 00:46:04.635
Oh hey, we were making fun
of the Catholic church.

00:46:04.665 --> 00:46:05.355
Oh, come on.

00:46:05.835 --> 00:46:08.655
So they got Earl Mann, Earl the Pearl.

00:46:08.715 --> 00:46:12.314
Earl had almost as nice a voice as yours.

00:46:12.515 --> 00:46:22.725
And he was the voice of the NFL.

00:46:22.995 --> 00:46:23.944
He was huge.

00:46:24.104 --> 00:46:24.444
Like you.

00:46:24.874 --> 00:46:27.654
Every, every time you turn on the
radio or television, you'd hear Earl.

00:46:27.654 --> 00:46:28.774
So they got Earl to do it.

00:46:28.774 --> 00:46:30.084
And it was a lovely voiceover.

00:46:30.174 --> 00:46:31.345
Nice little music in the background.

00:46:31.345 --> 00:46:33.745
Very, very, innocuous, apologetic.

00:46:34.015 --> 00:46:37.734
And it was like, you know, recently
on the radio show with Jesse and

00:46:37.734 --> 00:46:42.414
Gene, messers Jesse Dylan and Eugene
Vilitus, used his full name, Eugene

00:46:42.414 --> 00:46:46.584
Vilitus, were pretending to be and
purporting to be Catholic priests.

00:46:46.704 --> 00:46:50.035
Well, not only is that against the
law, it's against the principles of

00:46:50.035 --> 00:46:51.475
the Archdiocese and it went on and on.

00:46:51.475 --> 00:46:51.745
Right.

00:46:52.044 --> 00:46:54.865
And it basically self aggrandized
the church, the priest, the Cardinal,

00:46:54.865 --> 00:46:56.064
everybody else, the bishops.

00:46:56.154 --> 00:46:58.574
And it made Jesse and Jean look like bad.

00:46:59.189 --> 00:47:01.919
So that went really
well for the first week.

00:47:02.189 --> 00:47:08.519
And then tragically, regrettably, and
ironically, the touring version of Jesus

00:47:08.519 --> 00:47:13.169
Christ Superstar, the musical was in town,
appearing at the Royal Thompson Hall in

00:47:13.169 --> 00:47:14.939
Toronto, and they were up from New York.

00:47:14.939 --> 00:47:16.259
And it was a, yeah, a
big production, right?

00:47:16.259 --> 00:47:17.160
Jesus Christ Superstar.

00:47:17.279 --> 00:47:20.609
And they were advertising on the
radio station, but the voice that

00:47:20.609 --> 00:47:24.839
they used to voice Jesus Christ
Superstar, was not Jim Conrad.

00:47:24.990 --> 00:47:25.740
It was not Earl Mann.

00:47:26.214 --> 00:47:29.875
It was not Lauren Green, it was the
guy that does the monster truck pull,

00:47:30.055 --> 00:47:32.214
monster truck pull wristband policy.

00:47:32.214 --> 00:47:34.335
They ah, you know,
screaming like that, right?

00:47:34.794 --> 00:47:39.024
So the ad comes on and goes, big music,
big rock music go, Jesus Christ Superstar.

00:47:39.265 --> 00:47:40.015
It was meaner than that.

00:47:40.015 --> 00:47:42.355
It was like Jesus Christ, right?

00:47:42.355 --> 00:47:42.714
Slow.

00:47:42.714 --> 00:47:44.665
And I can't even say it right.

00:47:44.665 --> 00:47:45.564
It was the guy that,

00:47:45.564 --> 00:47:46.884
Jim Conrad: Can I try do it?

00:47:47.334 --> 00:47:50.825
Jesus Christ Superstar.

00:47:50.855 --> 00:47:51.024
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:47:51.294 --> 00:47:51.875
Now we got it.

00:47:51.875 --> 00:47:54.484
Do the Jesus Christ again,
but just a little bit angrier.

00:47:54.845 --> 00:47:56.525
Jim Conrad: Jesus Christ.

00:47:57.815 --> 00:48:00.095
Jesse Dylan: Now, well, as soon as
I heard that, oh, here's an idea.

00:48:00.935 --> 00:48:02.105
It went off in my head.

00:48:02.140 --> 00:48:04.505
I, I saw the whole thing
flash in front of my eyes.

00:48:04.985 --> 00:48:08.495
So I got Tony the cheap voice guy who
was our producer and did great voices.

00:48:08.884 --> 00:48:11.765
I said, Tony, lift those words.

00:48:11.825 --> 00:48:12.695
Jesus Christ.

00:48:13.174 --> 00:48:15.005
He said, are you gonna do what
I think, he said, don't do it.

00:48:15.005 --> 00:48:15.695
You're gonna get fired.

00:48:15.875 --> 00:48:16.295
Fuck you.

00:48:16.295 --> 00:48:16.805
You work for me.

00:48:16.805 --> 00:48:17.285
You're doing it.

00:48:17.915 --> 00:48:21.599
So, uh, he lifted Jesus Christ, put
thunder and lightning behind it.

00:48:22.049 --> 00:48:23.819
And so the very next day,
here's what you hear.

00:48:24.389 --> 00:48:26.369
Recently, you did the Jesus Christ.

00:48:26.399 --> 00:48:26.910
Okay?

00:48:26.914 --> 00:48:26.944
Okay.

00:48:27.119 --> 00:48:31.839
Recently on the Jesse and Jean Show,
messers Jesse Dylan and Eugene Vilitus

00:48:32.039 --> 00:48:34.410
were purporting to be Catholic priests.

00:48:34.559 --> 00:48:35.999
Jim Conrad: Jesus christ.

00:48:43.529 --> 00:48:44.224
Jesse Dylan: 60 seconds of that.

00:48:44.930 --> 00:48:48.259
And then toward the end it was
nothing but do Jesus Christ,

00:48:48.259 --> 00:48:49.460
over and over again on the fade.

00:48:49.490 --> 00:48:49.730
Okay?

00:48:50.195 --> 00:48:51.545
Jim Conrad: Jesus christ.

00:48:52.715 --> 00:48:54.065
Jesus Christ.

00:48:55.035 --> 00:48:56.384
Jesus Christ.

00:48:57.620 --> 00:48:57.830
Jesse Dylan: Yeah.

00:48:59.300 --> 00:49:01.910
Lawsuit was back on after the show.

00:49:02.510 --> 00:49:05.480
They were listening every day for
the ad. That didn't go over well.

00:49:05.540 --> 00:49:05.750
No.

00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:09.630
Clever.

00:49:10.970 --> 00:49:11.570
And brilliant.

00:49:11.570 --> 00:49:12.440
But it didn't go over well.

00:49:13.070 --> 00:49:13.940
I'll quickly end.

00:49:13.940 --> 00:49:16.880
I got off the air, 30 years,
nine o'clock in the morning.

00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:17.600
No one to play with.

00:49:18.080 --> 00:49:21.350
Gene and I would go into a studio,
we'd prerecord some, some shit.

00:49:21.410 --> 00:49:22.890
Uh, and then all day long.

00:49:23.910 --> 00:49:26.210
And throughout the day, someone would
call and say, Hey, Madonna's in town.

00:49:26.210 --> 00:49:26.839
I know where she's staying.

00:49:26.839 --> 00:49:28.040
You wanna try and get her guest?

00:49:28.040 --> 00:49:30.570
Lionel Alzado NFL, you know?

00:49:30.830 --> 00:49:32.089
Triumph is on tour.

00:49:32.150 --> 00:49:32.360
Yeah.

00:49:32.360 --> 00:49:33.020
Have him as a guest.

00:49:33.020 --> 00:49:36.740
8:15, 7:15. So all day you long,
you're doing this rolling show prep.

00:49:36.770 --> 00:49:40.190
Then the next day you show up, you've
got a fucking game plan like an NFL game.

00:49:40.250 --> 00:49:42.680
But you might change it, you might
throw it all out if something happens.

00:49:42.680 --> 00:49:43.279
Jim Conrad: Call an audible.

00:49:43.450 --> 00:49:44.589
Yeah, life was good.

00:49:44.680 --> 00:49:49.029
Uh, and, and in between all day long
having almost nothing to do, four

00:49:49.029 --> 00:49:51.999
fifths of five eighths a fuck all,
I became a member of the National

00:49:51.999 --> 00:49:55.479
Canadian Triathlon Team, competed in
55 events worldwide with the team.

00:49:56.080 --> 00:49:59.589
And my second hobby I was
negotiating deals for Jesse and Gene.

00:49:59.589 --> 00:50:03.129
We did record deals, we did these
deals, and I liked the art of

00:50:03.129 --> 00:50:06.700
negotiation and eventually that
led me to building companies.

00:50:06.759 --> 00:50:08.680
And today I've built eight companies.

00:50:09.399 --> 00:50:10.240
I sold a couple.

00:50:10.240 --> 00:50:11.589
One exploded brilliantly.

00:50:11.620 --> 00:50:12.759
And, um.

00:50:13.120 --> 00:50:14.289
I've taken five companies public.

00:50:14.919 --> 00:50:18.459
Jesse Dylan: What you've learned over all
of those years in broadcasting to be able

00:50:18.459 --> 00:50:23.529
to get into that boardroom and present
and develop a relationship immediately

00:50:23.529 --> 00:50:24.700
with whoever you're talking to.

00:50:25.149 --> 00:50:27.910
How much is story and the power
of storytelling a part of that?

00:50:28.209 --> 00:50:32.289
Every success that I've ever had in
my life, every success that I will

00:50:32.319 --> 00:50:36.189
ever have in my life is because
of the ability to tell a story.

00:50:36.700 --> 00:50:39.850
Whether I'm telling it or
somebody on my team is telling it.

00:50:40.400 --> 00:50:44.509
It won't be an AI chatbot telling it
because the AI chatbot doesn't have

00:50:44.509 --> 00:50:46.790
this emotional human connection.

00:50:46.970 --> 00:50:50.690
It's close, but when you're telling
a story and you're communicating

00:50:50.930 --> 00:50:54.170
at an effective level, that is a
difference between success and failure.

00:50:54.819 --> 00:50:55.209
Jim Conrad: Beautiful.

00:50:56.689 --> 00:50:59.019
Oh,

00:51:03.939 --> 00:51:10.235
how I love a great story, and I
also love playing Yuck Monkey to the

00:51:10.355 --> 00:51:12.700
Irreverent Snake Charmer, Jesse Dylan.

00:51:12.935 --> 00:51:14.195
What a marvelous storyteller.

00:51:14.645 --> 00:51:17.525
That's episode one of
the Conovison podcast.

00:51:17.735 --> 00:51:20.550
Thank you for listening, and thank
you for actually getting to the end.

00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:25.790
To hear this on episode one, we
rode the giant existential wave

00:51:25.820 --> 00:51:27.830
with JP Sartre and Aaron James.

00:51:28.040 --> 00:51:33.050
And I know after hearing the secular
story of creation from a profile in the

00:51:33.050 --> 00:51:38.030
New Yorker magazine from March 27th,
2017, called a Science of the Soul.

00:51:38.030 --> 00:51:42.620
A Philosopher's Quest to understand the
making of the mind, by Joshua Rothman.

00:51:43.050 --> 00:51:47.330
I don't think life here on earth
will ever be the same, do you?

00:51:48.169 --> 00:51:54.200
So stay by the stream for episode two
featuring a story about stories, a

00:51:54.200 --> 00:52:06.000
fractured fairytale, and the inimitable,
and I mean that sincerely, Bill Reiter aKA

00:52:06.240 --> 00:52:10.140
DJ ZigZag, the original groove and blue.

00:52:10.710 --> 00:52:15.029
And remember, we are
all stories to be told.

00:52:15.840 --> 00:52:21.540
I'm Jim Conrad, AKA Cono, and the
story of how I got that nickname will

00:52:21.540 --> 00:52:24.390
be an entire episode in and of itself.

00:52:24.900 --> 00:52:33.720
And this has been Conovison..